Comments - John Lear's Affidavit in the Morgan Reynolds lawsuit against NIST and its contractors - 9/11 Scholars Forum2024-03-28T12:53:31Zhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profiles/comment/feed?attachedTo=3488444%3ABlogPost%3A2596&xn_auth=noThe case has gone no where fo…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2012-03-09:3488444:Comment:475382012-03-09T16:20:59.270ZShallel Octaviahttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/Shallel
<p>The case <em>has</em> gone no where for exactly the reasons Chuck has stated. I witnessed this at Dr. Wood's appeal. The judge displayed no knowledge of even high school level physics. It was the same with Morgan's trial. Corrupt and stupid is the state of our court system. It seems we are engaged in so much intellectual masturbation that is not grokked by the public, nor the legal system. Short of a regime change including the Federal Court Clown Posse, Congress, the Senate, as well as the…</p>
<p>The case <em>has</em> gone no where for exactly the reasons Chuck has stated. I witnessed this at Dr. Wood's appeal. The judge displayed no knowledge of even high school level physics. It was the same with Morgan's trial. Corrupt and stupid is the state of our court system. It seems we are engaged in so much intellectual masturbation that is not grokked by the public, nor the legal system. Short of a regime change including the Federal Court Clown Posse, Congress, the Senate, as well as the Oval Office puppet, we cannot appeal to the laws that govern our Nation, though the Laws of Motion, as far as I can tell, still apply and are understood by the above average human minds here.</p> Sounds like a great case, onl…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2012-03-09:3488444:Comment:475282012-03-09T00:01:41.773ZChuck Boldwynhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/ChuckBoldwyn
Sounds like a great case, only if the lawyers, jurors, & especially the presiding Judge can understand it all.<br />
Desperately required will be lawyers with scientific background, like patent attorneys, choosing jurors with scientific backgrounds, like physicists & engineers with aeronautics backgrounds, and a Judge<br />
With a hard-core scientific background.<br />
Without scientific people being most highly involved, the case may go nowhere!!!
Sounds like a great case, only if the lawyers, jurors, & especially the presiding Judge can understand it all.<br />
Desperately required will be lawyers with scientific background, like patent attorneys, choosing jurors with scientific backgrounds, like physicists & engineers with aeronautics backgrounds, and a Judge<br />
With a hard-core scientific background.<br />
Without scientific people being most highly involved, the case may go nowhere!!! Thanks for your gracious resp…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2009-07-29:3488444:Comment:26272009-07-29T18:08:32.000ZJames H. Fetzerhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/JamesHFetzer
Thanks for your gracious response, Brian. If you think about the damage that small birds inflict upon planes when they are hit in air and weigh only a few ounces, it should become apparent that, whether they were box-like or solid (and I suppose they were box-like), impacting with even one of those supporting column plates would have inflicted massive damage on the plane--even if it had been suspended in space like a bird! So I think the situation is beyond salvaging. Let me know if you study…
Thanks for your gracious response, Brian. If you think about the damage that small birds inflict upon planes when they are hit in air and weigh only a few ounces, it should become apparent that, whether they were box-like or solid (and I suppose they were box-like), impacting with even one of those supporting column plates would have inflicted massive damage on the plane--even if it had been suspended in space like a bird! So I think the situation is beyond salvaging. Let me know if you study killtown's diagrams, which are especially helpful in understanding the structure and how it was designed. Thank you for your response,…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2009-07-29:3488444:Comment:26262009-07-29T17:48:33.000ZBrian Goodhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/BrianGood
Thank you for your response, Dr. Fetzer. I realize my characterization of the question as yes-or-no was comical. I think that the difference between solid columns and tubular thin-wall columns makes a great deal of difference from the standpoint of physics--for the plane to penetrate solid columns is implausible, and Mr.<br />
Lear's failure to clarify that that's not his problem with the impact is a weakness in his presentation IMHO.<br />
<br />
I don't find the penetration of tubular box columns implausible,…
Thank you for your response, Dr. Fetzer. I realize my characterization of the question as yes-or-no was comical. I think that the difference between solid columns and tubular thin-wall columns makes a great deal of difference from the standpoint of physics--for the plane to penetrate solid columns is implausible, and Mr.<br />
Lear's failure to clarify that that's not his problem with the impact is a weakness in his presentation IMHO.<br />
<br />
I don't find the penetration of tubular box columns implausible, though you certainly raise some intriguing points. I guess your thesis is that crushing the fuselage section forward of the wing box should have consumed significant amounts of energy before the wings even hit the building. One supposes that NIST's exhaustive modeling of stuff like the structure of the airplane provides calculations providing some departure point for energetic analysis. I wonder if they honestly modeled the wingbox or it that was something they<br />
"forgot"?<br />
<br />
Thank you for your stimulating thoughts! Well, you can follow up by li…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2009-07-29:3488444:Comment:26252009-07-29T17:12:36.000ZJames H. Fetzerhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/JamesHFetzer
Well, you can follow up by listening to my interview with John on "The Real Deal", which occurred this Monday, 27 July 2009, and should be archived shortly at radiofetzer.blogspot.com. My understanding is that it was done in relation to Judy Wood's lawsuit, even though it only indirectly dealt with planes. Remember that the official account is that it was the combination of the damage by the aircraft impacts together with the resulting fires that cause the steel to weaken, the upper floors to…
Well, you can follow up by listening to my interview with John on "The Real Deal", which occurred this Monday, 27 July 2009, and should be archived shortly at radiofetzer.blogspot.com. My understanding is that it was done in relation to Judy Wood's lawsuit, even though it only indirectly dealt with planes. Remember that the official account is that it was the combination of the damage by the aircraft impacts together with the resulting fires that cause the steel to weaken, the upper floors to collapse, and all the rest. If there were no planes, there were no aircraft impacts or resulting fires, so I think Jerry Leaphart viewed his testimony as appropriate for submission to the court.<br />
<br />
As for Brian's "simple yes or no" question, I will ask him about that, but it seems to me, from the point of view of physics, it hardly matters. The plane was made of aluminum, its nose is extremely fragile, and there is no way that the physics of the situation would have not resulted in compacting the fuselage, breaking off the tail, and major parts falling to the ground, none of which in fact occurred. Since no one is suggesting that the plane should have "bounced off" the building, you are resorting to a "straw man", which is an exaggerated version of a position that makes it easier to attack when a less vulnerable version is at hand. Look at the diagrams on killtown's site and you will see the problems that arguments like this one encounter. Hi Dr. Fetzer. I think I aske…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2009-07-29:3488444:Comment:26212009-07-29T07:33:21.000ZBrian Goodhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/BrianGood
Hi Dr. Fetzer. I think I asked a simple yes-or-no question. Was Mr. Lear aware that the columns were box columns with 1/4" walls or did he think they were solid? And I think you did not answer it.<br />
<br />
I am well aware of the 4" concrete floors and the whole litany, and I agree with you that if as it appears the plane did not slow down when the wings hit the wall that is something meriting further investigation.<br />
<br />
On the other hand it appears to me that since most of the mass of the plane hits on…
Hi Dr. Fetzer. I think I asked a simple yes-or-no question. Was Mr. Lear aware that the columns were box columns with 1/4" walls or did he think they were solid? And I think you did not answer it.<br />
<br />
I am well aware of the 4" concrete floors and the whole litany, and I agree with you that if as it appears the plane did not slow down when the wings hit the wall that is something meriting further investigation.<br />
<br />
On the other hand it appears to me that since most of the mass of the plane hits on portions of the perimeter columns unbolstered by floors, since the walls of the perimeter box columns were only 1/4", and since the<br />
plane debris can be sheared by the resistance of the floors, the belief that the tower structure should have rejected the plane structure to the extent of the latter bouncing off is questionable. Egad! How many times must I e…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2009-07-28:3488444:Comment:26032009-07-28T15:23:07.000ZJames H. Fetzerhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/JamesHFetzer
Egad! How many times must I explain that the external support columns were welded to steel trusses, which were welded to the core columns and filled with four inches of concrete! That's an acre of concrete per floor. As a diagram from killtown display--visit http://killtown.911review.org/wtc-gallery.html--Flight 175 intersected with eight of those floors. Anyone who thinks the plane should not have crumpled and broken apart--with massive debris falling to the ground, precisely as John Lear…
Egad! How many times must I explain that the external support columns were welded to steel trusses, which were welded to the core columns and filled with four inches of concrete! That's an acre of concrete per floor. As a diagram from killtown display--visit http://killtown.911review.org/wtc-gallery.html--Flight 175 intersected with eight of those floors. Anyone who thinks the plane should not have crumpled and broken apart--with massive debris falling to the ground, precisely as John Lear describes--does not understand the structure of the towers. Not only did no deceleration occur, but--by counting frames, as Joe Keith has recommended--it is possible to determine that the speed of the plane shown in the video passes though its entire length into the building as effortlessly as it passes through its entire length through air. Sorry, but you are off-base on this one. And are you unaware of the damage to planes caused by impacts with tiny birds weighing only a few ounces? I think you need to reconsider and think this matter through. John is completely right about this and you are wrong. Since Mr. Lear does not descr…tag:911scholars.ning.com,2009-07-28:3488444:Comment:25982009-07-28T07:52:44.000ZBrian Goodhttp://911scholars.ning.com/profile/BrianGood
Since Mr. Lear does not describe the building columns I can't help wondering if his incredulity about the plane's penetration of the perimeter wall is based on the belief that these 14" x 14" columns were solid steel. They were hollow box columns, and at the top of the building their walls were only 1/4" thick.<br />
<br />
The argument that the plane should have slowed when the wings hit the building is worth considering.
Since Mr. Lear does not describe the building columns I can't help wondering if his incredulity about the plane's penetration of the perimeter wall is based on the belief that these 14" x 14" columns were solid steel. They were hollow box columns, and at the top of the building their walls were only 1/4" thick.<br />
<br />
The argument that the plane should have slowed when the wings hit the building is worth considering.