HOW INDEED CAN NANOTHERMITE BE EXPLOSIVE?

[Dr. J. P. Hubert]

HOW INDEED CAN NANOTHERMITE BE EXPLOSIVE?
& THE NANOTHERMITE CHALLENGE

T Mark Hightower, B.S., M.S., Chemical Engineering

INTRODUCTION

This paper explores the explosiveness of nanothermite.

Steven E. Jones made the error early in his research, of classifying nanothermite as an explosive in the same category as the high explosive RDX, with no published science to back up his claim. The 911 truth movement has never recovered from this error, for to this day nearly everyone in the movement refers to "explosive nanothermite," as even this clever cover for a fictitious "For Dummies" book illustrates. (1)

Examples of Jones confusing these issues are cited and commented upon. Two technical papers on nanothermite are cited to support my contention that nanothermite is not anywhere near being an explosive in the sense of a high explosive like RDX. These two papers are also cited on the issue of adding organics to nanothermites to produce gas generating nano-thermites (GGNT) and I maintain that these papers suggest that the only way to make a nanothermite truly explosive is to combine it with an explosive or other high-explosive mechanism. “It's not the “nano” that makes it explosive. It's the explosive that makes it explosive.”

Finally, I make recommendations of what those who advocate the nanothermite theory for WTC destruction can do to clarify their position and I announce The Nanothermite Challenge.

EXAMPLES OF JONES CONFUSING THERMITE AND NANO-THERMITE WITH EXPLOSIVES

Here is a two-paragraph quote from Steven Jones' first paper. (2)

“Thus, molten metal was repeatedly observed and formally reported in the rubble piles of the WTC Towers and WTC 7, metal that looked like molten steel or perhaps iron. Scientific analysis would be needed to conclusively ascertain the composition of the molten metal in detail.”

“I maintain that these observations are consistent with the use of high-temperature cutter-charges such as thermite, HMX or RDX or some combination thereof, routinely used to melt/cut/demolish steel.” (2)

Here Jones puts thermite, HMX, and RDX in the same category. But thermite is totally different than HMX and RDX. Thermite is an incendiary. It gets very hot, it produces molten iron, it can melt steel, and it can catch things on fire, but it is absolutely not an explosive. It is not even a low explosive. On the other hand, HMX and RDX are high explosives. HMX detonates at 9,100 m/s (meters per second) and RDX detonates at 8,750 m/s. He also lumps all three under the category of cutter-charges, but a cutter-charge with thermite would be totally different than a cutter-charge with a high explosive. A thermite cutter-charge would cut by melting the steel with the high-temperature molten iron it produces (an extremely low velocity and slow process compared to high explosives), whereas an RDX cutter-charge would cut by the supersonic detonation of high explosives in what is known as a shaped charge, which essentially produces a supersonic projectile of molten metal (copper is often used in shaped charges) that instantly penetrates and severs the member.

Later in the paper Jones says

“"Superthermites" use tiny particles of aluminum known as "nanoaluminum" (<120 nanometers) in order to increase their reactivity. Explosive superthermites are formed by mixing nanoaluminum powder with fine metal oxide particles such as micron-scale iron oxide dust.” (2) And further down he says “Highly exothermic reactions other than jet-fuel or office-material fires, such as thermite reactions which produce white-hot molten metal as an end product, are clearly implied by the data. In addition, the use of explosives such as HMX or RDX should be considered. "Superthermites" are also explosive as must be remembered in any in-depth investigation which considers hypotheses suggested by the available data.” (2) From page 85 of a presentation that Jones gave early in his work (3), he says “Gel explosives: Tiny aluminum particles in iron oxide, in a sol-gel: “High energy density and extremely powerful” and “can be cast to shape”. http://www.llnl.gov/str/RSimpson.html (Livermore Nat’l Lab, 2000) I have read the LLNL web page that Jones cites above (4) very carefully and I cannot find anything in it that implies that the “thermitic nanocomposite energetic material” referred to is an explosive. It refers to the result as a thermite pyrotechnic, releasing an enormous amount of heat, but it does not say that it is an explosive. In the web page another class is explained briefly, energetic nanocrystalline composites. "The Livermore team synthesized nanocrystalline composites in a silica matrix with pores containing the high explosive RDX or PETN." No mention is made here of thermite, so this wouldn't apply to Jones claiming that nanothermite is an explosive.
WTC Devastation by public domain

COMPARING NANOTHERMITE REACTION VELOCITIES TO EXPLOSIVE VELOCITIES

The explanation given for claiming that nanothermite is an explosive goes something like this. The thermite reaction is

Fe2O3 + 2 Al ---> 2 Fe + Al2O3

By making the particle sizes of the reactants smaller, down to the nanosize (approximately 30 nm to 60 nm) and mixing them well, the reaction takes place so fast that it becomes explosive. Let's look at some data from technical papers where the reaction velocity of nanothermites were measured and compare these values with the reaction velocities of explosives to see if it seems reasonable to call nanothermite an explosive.

A paper by Spitzer et al. published in the Journal of Physics and Chemistry of Solids in 2010 presents a variety of research on energetic nano-materials. (5) In one section they deal with nano-thermites made with tungsten trioxide (WO3) and aluminum nano-particles. They experimented with different particle sizes, but they highlight the mixture made with the smallest nano-particles of both WO3 and Al for its impressive performance.

“WO3/Al nano-thermites, which contain only nano-particles, have an impressive reactivity. The fireball generated by the deflagration is so hot that a slamming due to overpressure is heard. The combustion rate can reach 7.3 m/s. This value is extremely high compared to classical energetic materials.” (5)

A paper by Clapsaddle et al. published by Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in 2005 also contains some reaction rate data for nanothermite composed of nano-particles of Fe2O3 and aluminum. (6) In Figure 2. in the paper the combustion velocity is plotted versus percent SiO2 content. The highest values were obtained at zero percent SiO2, so those are the only values I am going to cite. The nanothermite produced by a sol gel process had the highest velocity of 40.5 m/s, compared to the one produced by a simple mixing of the nano-particles with a combustion velocity of 8.8 m/s. (6)

Compare the above combustion velocities of nanothermite with the detonation velocities of high explosives HMX and RDX of 9,100 m/s and 8,750 m/s, respectively, and they are dwarfed by the velocities of the conventional high explosives. Steven Jones appears to be calling the nanothermite reaction explosive only in the sense that it is reacting much faster than regular thermite, but not in the sense that it is anywhere near as explosive as a conventional high explosive. By failing to make this distinction Jones has misled nearly the entire 911 truth movement into believing that nanothermite is a super explosive, possibly even more powerful than conventional high explosives.

From the above, it is quite clear that the “nano” in nanothermite does not make the thermite explosive anywhere near the degree of a high explosive like RDX.

In addition to saying that nano-izing thermite makes it explosive, I have heard Jones say that adding organics to nanothermite also makes it explosive. This issue is explored in the next section.

CAN ANYTHING BE DONE TO MAKE A NANOTHERMITE EXPLOSIVE?

First I would like to quote an entire two paragraph section, with its title, from the LLNL paper. (6)

“Gas generating Al-Fe2O3-SiO3/2-R (R = –(CH2)2(CF2)7CF3) nanocomposites. ”

“One limitation inherent in any thermite energetic material is the inability of the energetic material to do pressure/volume-work on an object. Thermites release energy in the form of heat and light, but are unable to move objects. Typically, work can be done by a rapidly produced gas that is released during the energetic reaction. Towards this end, the silica phase of sol-gel prepared oxidizers, in addition to modifying the burning velocities, has also been used to incorporate organic functionality that will decompose and generate gas upon ignition of the energetic composite [3-4, 7]. Phenomenological burn observations of these materials indicate that the Al-Fe2O3-SiO3/2-R nanocomposites burn very rapidly and violently, essentially to completion, with the generation of significant amounts of gas. Figure 5 shows a comparison of the ignition of an energetic nanocomposite oxidizer mixed with 2 μm aluminum metal without (left) and with (middle) organic functionalization. The still image of the energetic nanocomposite without organic functionalization exhibits rapid ignition and emission of light and heat. The still image of the energetic nanocomposite with organic functionalization also exhibits these characteristics, but it also exhibits hot particle ejection due to the production of gas upon ignition. This reaction is very exothermic and results in the production of very high temperatures, intense light, and pressure from the generation of the gaseous byproducts resulting from the decomposition of the organic moieties.”

“These materials were also mixed with nanometer aluminum. Figure 5 (right) shows a still image of the ignition of the Al-Fe2O3-SiO3/2-R nanocomposite mixed with 40 nm aluminum. This composite is much more reactive than the same oxidizing phase mixed with 2 μm aluminum metal; the burning of the composite with 40 nm aluminum occurs much too quickly to be able to observe the hot particle ejection. This observation is a good example of the importance mixing and the size scale of the reactants can have on the physical properties of the final energetic composite material. When the degree of mixing is on the nanoscale, the material is observed to react much more quickly, presumably due to the increase in mass transport rates of the reactants, as discussed above.” (6)

Note that in the title of the section quoted above, the symbol R is used to represent the organic functionality added to the nanothermite. In this case it is a 10 carbon atom straight chain functional group fully saturated, with hydrogen atoms on the first two carbon atoms of the chain and fluorine atoms on all the rest. I have not explored the precise energy level of this functional group, but I can tell by just looking at it that it will consume energy (from the thermite reaction) in order to break it down into multiple smaller molecules in order to get the expanding gases necessary to make it behave as explained. This is not an efficient way to make an explosive. I wouldn't expect the explosiveness to be anywhere near that of a conventional high explosive, and the qualitative description given in the paper certainly does not seem to support it being a true explosive, but unfortunately the paper does not give data on what its reaction rate would be. Wouldn't it be better if the organic added to the nanothermite was a molecule that, instead of consuming energy to drive its decomposition, actually produces energy as it decomposes? Such a molecule could be the RDX molecule. This leads to the quoted two-paragraph section below from the Spitzer et al. paper. (5)

“3. Gas generating nano-thermites ”

“Thermites are energetic materials, which do not release gaseous species when they decompose. However, explosives can be blended in thermites to give them blasting properties. The idea developed at ISL is to solidify explosives in porous inorganic matrixes described previously. Gas generating nano-thermites (GGNT) are prepared by mixing Cr2O3/RDX and MnO2/RDX materials with aluminium nano-particles. The combustion mechanisms of these nano-thermites were investigated by DSC and high-speed video. In the case of Cr2O3-based GGNT, the decomposition of RDX induces the expansion and the fragmentation of the oxide matrix. The resulting Cr2O3 nano-particles, which are preheated by the combustion of the explosive, react violently with aluminium nano-particles. In the case of MnO2-based GGNT, the mechanism of combustion is somewhat different because the decomposition of RDX induces the melting of oxide particles. The droplets of molten MnO2 react with aluminium nano-particles.”

“The non-confined combustion of GGNT is rather slow (1-11 cm/s) in comparison with other nano-thermites presented here. However, in a confined environment their combustion rate is expected to be significantly higher. Indeed, the thermal decomposition of GGNT produces gaseous species, which contribute to increase the pressure and the combustion rate in accordance with the Vieille’s law. The thermal decomposition of miscellaneous GGNT compositions was studied in a closed vessel equipped with a pressure gauge. The GGNT were fired with a laser beam through a quartz window. The pressure signal was recorded along time for each material (Fig. 7). The pressure released by the combustion of a GGNT is directly linked to the RDX content of the nano-composite used to elaborate it. Depending on its formulation, a GGNT can provide a pressure ranging from a few bars to nearly three thousand bars.” (5)

I am surprised by the low number given for the reaction velocity, only 1-11 cm/s. Also, it does not say what percent RDX resulted in this low velocity. Maybe it was a very low content of RDX. But the main point I want to make about the above quoted section does not depend on this velocity anyway. The key point is that you have to blend explosives (like RDX) into nanothermite to make it an explosive (“give them blasting properties”).

WHAT NANOTHERMITE ADVOCATES NEED TO DO TO CLARIFY THEIR THEORY

Steven E. Jones and other nanothermite theory advocates should be upfront and truthful about these issues, and clearly elaborate upon the factors missing from their theory that need further fleshing out. It is not good enough to just say “explosive nanothermite” over and over again without explaining exactly what is meant by the term. If they think that incendiary thermite or incendiary nanothermite or low explosive nanothermite or high explosive nanothermite were used in cutter-charges, or some combination, then they should say so. The lack of or degree of explosiveness claimed, whether incendiary, low explosive, or high explosive, is key, because the type of cutter-charge used would depend on this. Once they clarify what they mean by their use of the term “nanothermite”, then they should start describing the quantities of thermite that would have been necessary for the destruction. Only by adding these details to their theory can it be fairly evaluated against alternative theories of the destruction of the buildings of the World Trade Center for the benefit of the wider 9/11 truth community.
___________________________________

THE NANOTHERMITE CHALLENGE

Find and document peer reviewed scientific research that demonstrates that a gas generating nanothermite (GGNT) based upon iron (III) oxide (Fe2O3) and aluminum (Al), where the gas generating chemical added to the nanothermite is not itself a high explosive, can be made to be a high explosive with at least a detonation velocity of 2000 m/s. The author of this paper will donate $100 for every 1000 m/s of detonation velocity that can be documented, the donation not to exceed $1,000. For example, if a detonation velocity of 5500 m/s can be documented, then the donation amount will be $550. Only one prize will be awarded in the form of a donation to AE911Truth, and it will be awarded based upon the highest detonation velocity that can be documented. Those submitting entries grant the author the right to publish their entries. Entries must be in the form of a brief (no longer than one page) write-up, with the peer reviewed research cited, and at least scanned copies (electronic pdf files) of the cover page(s) and pages relied upon of the technical papers, if not a submittal of the entire paper(s). Entries should be sent by email to [e-mail] by June 20, 2011. The award will be announced and paid by July 20, 2011.

1 May 2011

ABOUT THE AUTHOR: T. Mark Hightower began his awakening in January 2004 after having stumbled upon the Serendipity web site and learning that the explosive demolition theory for WTC destruction was a more probable explanation than was the official story.

http://www.serendipity.li/

He has worked as an engineer for nearly 30 years, initially in the chemical industry, then in the space program, and currently in the environmental field. He is a member of the American Institute of Chemical Engineers (AIChE) and the American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics (AIAA).

His research on 9/11 is an exercise of his Constitutional rights as a private citizen and in no way represents his employer or the professional societies of which he is a member.

REFERENCES

(1) Fictitious Book Cover, “Explosives in the WTC for Dummies”

(2) Jones, Steven E., “Why Indeed Did the WTC Buildings Completely Collapse?” Journal of 911 Studies, Volume 3, September 2006

(3) Jones, Steven E., “Answers to Objections and Questions,” Department of Physics and Astronomy, Brigham Young University, 18 July 2006

(4) LLNL Web page cited by Jones – “Nanoscale Chemistry Yields Better Explosives,”

http://www.llnl.gov/str/RSimpson.html

(5) Denis Spitzer, Marc Comet, Christian Baras, Vincent Pichot, Nelly Piazzon, “Energetic nano-materials: Opportunities for enhanced performances,” Institut franco-allemand de recherches de Saint-Louis (ISL), UMR ISL/CNRS 3208, 5, rue du General Cassagnou, 68301 Saint-Louis, France,
Journal of Physics and Chemistry of Solids 71 (2010) 100–108

(6) B. J. Clapsaddle, L. Zhao, D. Prentice, M. L. Pantoya, A. E. Gash, J. H. Satcher Jr., K. J. Shea, R. L. Simpson, “Formulation and Performance of Novel Energetic Nanocomposites and Gas Generators Prepared by Sol-Gel Methods,” March 25, 2005, Presented at 36th Annual Conference of ICT, Karlsruhe, Germany, June 28, 2005 through July 1, 2005 UCRL-PROC-210871, LLNL This paper is free to download at
http://www.osti.gov/bridge/product.biblio.jsp?query_id=0&page=0...

[T Mark Hightower]

Kevin Ryan on explosive nanothermite.

 

On June 20, 2011, Kevin Ryan submitted an article on 911 blogger entitled “The explosive nature of nanothermite.” In the comments, Frank Legge posted “An open letter to T Mark Hightower.”

http://911blogger.com/news/2011-06-20/explosive-nature-nanothermite

In Kevin Ryan's article he tries to make the case that nanothermite is
really explosive.  Most of the references he gives are rather vague in
that they may use the word "explosive" but they don't give the
detonation velocity of a specifically identified nanothermite.  None of
his references would have been adequate to meet The Nanothermite
Challenge.  Actually, to be fair, he has one reference that is kind of
borderline, as it refers to "generating shock waves with Mach numbers up
to 3."

http://apl.aip.org/applab/v91/i24/p243109_s1?isAuthorized=no

From the above link you can only read the Abstract of the paper.  This
is a paper that I was already familiar with, and I had paid $41 to
download the complete 3 page paper.  I was able to verify that it does
not meet The Nanothermite Challenge.  Interestingly, even though it
cites an enhanced combustion wave speed of up to 2200 m/s for a CuO
nanorod Al nanoparticle self assembled composite, the paper actually
supports my contention that a nanothermite cannot possibly achieve a
detonation velocity anywhere near that of conventional high explosives
like TNT, RDX, and HMX, with detonation velocities of 6900 m/s, 8750
m/s, and 9100 m/s, respectively. Quoting from the paper, but omitting a
lengthy parenthesis with a lot of references to conventional explosives
and their detonation velocities, it says, "Interestingly, these higher
combustion wave speeds are comparable to the lower end values of the
detonation velocities for explosives."

If you scroll down about half way on the previously cited 911 blogger
web page, you will see "An open letter to T Mark Hightower" that was
submitted by Frank Legge.  It turns out this comes from a Facebook
interchange that Frank legge and I had some weeks ago.  Why didn't Frank
Legge post my response to him? (I will paste it below) The readers might get both sides of the
argument if he did that.

Anyway, Frank Legge kind of gives away the game when he says, "You say
your offer of $1000 is generous. It is not. You know that the highest
propagation velocities in the literature are less than your cut-off
level."

So please let me explain.  You have Kevin Ryan making a strong
qualitative case for the significant explosiveness of nanothermite, but
then you have Frank Legge telling me that The Nanothermite Challenge is
not possible to meet because I have set the cut-off detonation velocity
too high at 2000 meters per second.  But a detonation velocity of 2000
m/s is about as low as you can go and still be considered a high
explosive.  So in effect, you have Frank Legge admitting here that he
believes there is no peer reviewed scientific research which supports a
high explosive nanothermite.

So why does AE911Truth insist on claiming that nanothermite can be
formulated as a high explosive?  And suppose it could be formulated with
a detonation velocity at the low end of a high explosive, like 2200 m/s,
to use the value from the above cited paper, would that be impressive for
its destructive power?  No, not at all, when you consider how much
higher the detonation velocities are for the conventional high
explosives.


MY RESPONSE TO FRANK LEGGE IS PASTED BELOW

May 15, 2011

To Frank Legge,

You question the fairness of my offer in The Nanothermite Challenge. AE911Truth said in an editorial article of April 5, 2009 that nanothermite “can be formulated as a high explosive.”
http://www2.ae911truth.org/info/51

If their statement were true, then someone should be able to document that and claim my prize. I set the cut off at a detonation velocity of 2000 m/s, which is a very low value for a high explosive.

You apparently missed this quote from Jones' first paper that I cited in my paper showing that Jones clearly put nanothermite in the same category of explosive as the high explosive RDX.

“Highly exothermic reactions other than jet-fuel or office-material fires, such as thermite reactions which produce white-hot molten metal as an end product, are clearly implied by the data. In addition, the use of explosives such as HMX or RDX should be considered. 'Superthermites' are also explosive as must be remembered in any in-depth investigation which considers hypotheses suggested by the available data.”

Clearly, if I may paraphrase, Jones is saying that superthermites are also explosive as are HMX and RDX. If he only meant that superthermites are low explosives then his statement is misleading. His statement should then have said something like this, to get his idea across more clearly. “Unlike HMX and RDX, superthermites are low explosives, as must be remembered in any in-depth investigation which considers hypotheses suggested by the available data.”

You said of me and my paper, “You are trying to get your reader to think about the intensity of a nanothermite explosion.” You are absolutely correct here. When it is claimed over and over again that “explosive nanothermite” was used, what could be more important than considering the intensity of the explosiveness? A cutter charge using an incendiary or low explosive would have to be crafted much differently than a cutter charge using a high explosive. Being noncommittal to addressing these issues hurts the credibility of AE911Truth's position.

There is much in my paper that you have not commented upon. Does that mean that you agree with those parts, or can't find anything to criticize? Of course this is what people do, they try to find any areas of weakness that they can criticize, but fail to say what they agree with or what they can't find fault with.

You criticize the use of the term “finely granulated form of thermite” as a description of nanothermite. If I had your comment before finalizing the paper I might have worded this differently. I would just like to point out that the sol gel process is not the only means of producing a nanothermite, as the Clapsaddle et al. paper that I reference indicates that mechanical mixing can also be used. I quote from this paper below.

“The goal of this work is to examine the influence of SiO2 on the energy release properties of the Fe2O3–Al thermite reaction. This objective was accomplished by comparing the combustion velocities of two separate Fe2O3-SiO2–Al nanocomposites: one prepared from mixing commercially obtained nanoparticles of Fe2O3, SiO2, and Al (Thermite A); and, the other prepared by combining nanoparticles of Al with the sol-gel prepared, Fe2O3-SiO2 aerogel oxidizers described above (Thermite B).”

Your point about the use of the word pulverize is well taken. If I had your comments before finalizing the paper I likely would have worded this differently. I will just say that I was not using this term in the sense of pulverizing all the steel, but only in the sense of pulverizing the steel where it was cut, for example as by the effects of a high explosive.

Finally, where you charge me with deliberately trying to deceive, you are wrong in your assessment of my motivations. I am a petition signer at Architects and Engineers for 911 Truth, and I want to see that the claims that they make are as solid as they can possibly be. I have tried pointing out these things to the big wheels in the nanothermite camp since last August, but I finally felt it necessary to write a paper to gets my points across, since they were not addressing my concerns.

AE911Truth can't have it both ways, freely criticizing those they do not agree with, and failing to respond to valid criticisms against their position. If they say that nanothermite can be formulated as a high explosive, is it too much to ask that they document their claim? Are they somehow above such criticisms and questions?

I lay these issues out before all to judge for themselves.

T Mark Hightower

[T Mark Hightower]

June 22, 2011 Press Release

 

HIGH-EXPLOSIVE NANOTHERMITE MORE BARK THAN BITE?
No Contenders for The Nanothermite Challenge
__________________________________
On May 1, 2011 chemical engineer and AE911Truth petition signer T.
Mark Hightower of San Jose, CA presented The Nanothermite Challenge,
calling for peer-reviewed scientific documentation that nanothermite
could be "formulated as a high explosive." This claim was made in
April 2009 by Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth, a growing group
of professionals calling for a new, independent 9/11 investigation,
in part based on the research of physicist Steven Jones.

The Nanothermite Challenge: "Find and document peer-reviewed
scientific research that demonstrates that a gas-generating
nanothermite (GGNT) based upon iron (III) oxide (Fe2O3) and aluminum
(Al), where the gas-generating chemical added to the nanothermite is
not itself a high explosive, can be made to be a high explosive with
at least a detonation velocity of 2000 m/s. The author of this paper
will donate $100 for every 1000 m/s of detonation velocity that can
be documented, the donation not to exceed $1,000."

The deadline of June 20 for The Nanothermite Challenge passed with no
entries received. On June 19, 2011, retired NASA executive and
AE911Truth petition signer Dwain Deets stated, "What I would like to
see is AE911Truth retract their claim, as well as any other 911Truth
advocates who now make this claim. It would be great to see the
documented research come forward in the manner outlined in The
Nanothermite Challenge before the 10th Anniversary, so those who make
these claims can do so with a solid basis."

[Jeannon Kralj]

This is good information, but as you say, it should have also all been posted at 911blogger.  911blogger has been a bad joke for a long time. 

 

Here is a posting on 911 blogger that explains how BYU fully supported Jones and his "work".  Very odd that Neocon U. was so involved and supportive of the work of Dr. Jones since the story at the time by Dr. Jones was that he was forced out and forced into early retirement because of his studies that supposedly were against the official story and the Bush administration.

 

http://911blogger.com/news/2010-05-09/byu-and-prof-steven-jones-rev...

 

 

http://willyloman.wordpress.com/2011/05/13/steven-jones-continues-t...

Here is a discussion of how Dr. Jones is now talking about Tesla and building destruction, so somehow not Dr. Wood and Dr. Jones are synthesizing.  For what purpose, I do not know.  But the tenth anniversary of 9-11 is upon us and no way this time will not be used by those involved in further 9-11 disinformation.

 

Steven Jones Continues to Demo Truth Movement

Posted on May 13, 2011 by willyloman

by Scott Creighton

UPDATE: A note to the remaining Truth advocates at 9/11 Blogger (see the end of the article)

 

 

[Thoth II]

Here is a discussion of how Dr. Jones is now talking about Tesla and building destruction, so somehow not Dr. Wood and Dr. Jones are synthesizing.  For what purpose, I do not know.  But the tenth anniversary of 9-11 is upon us and no way this time will not be used by those involved in further 9-11 disinformation.

 

yes, this is weird.  Steve Jones stubbornly maintains thermate did the whole job, I don't get it, thermate is a steel cutter, he is probably disinfo.

Dr. Wood stubbornly maintains that DEWs were involved, why since Chuck has shown that all her objections can be explained much simpler.

 

It's like these people are living in their own realities and the effect is to divert the public's attention from the real truth of 911.  It's like in JFK they made a fake Z film to give a totally wrong series of events.

[Dr. J. P. Hubert]

I think Mark Hightower has conducted himself ethically and has acted in good faith with respect to the investigation of whether thermite/nanothermite is a high explosive agent. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said for some of his detractors. 

 

In my view Mark has amply demonstrated that Thermite/nanothermite is not a high explosive in the category of RDX, HMX or PETN—no one met the nanothermite challenge or even attempted to. It is almost immaterial whether Thermite/nanothermite was used in some secondary or tertiary capacity as an adjunct to much more powerful agents. There is simply too much evidence which demonstrates that both Twin Towers were totally destroyed as a result of enormous explosive energy releases completely unlike the standard implosion type controlled demolitions seen in the intentional destruction of high-rise buildings; a difference in type or kind not just in degree.

 

No one to my knowledge has produced an example of a high-rise demolition (controlled or otherwise) in which so much of the building's mass was converted to dust. That remains the elephant in the room. What mechanism is capable of performing that kind of work?  Even if it is assumed that an astronomical amount of conventional (RDX, HMX, PETN etc.) explosives were utilized to destroy each Twin Tower, there is no historical precedent for so much of a high rise building’s concrete being literally pulverized into fine dust.

 

Perhaps Mark or some other chemical or demolition engineer with the requisite expertise could perform the calculation for us of how many tons of conventional explosive would be required to completely destroy the Twin Towers—for completeness sake this calculation should be produced. Presumably the amount involved would be incompatible with clandestine placement inside each building without being discovered.

 

It seems to me in light of everything that is now known, anyone who still wants to talk about thermite/nanothermite as the only or main agent involved in the destruction of the Twin Towers must be assumed to be an agent of disinformation. The real story is the strong likelihood that each Twin Tower was destroyed either through the use of nuclear (fission type) explosions or some kind of classified DFEW technology. I currently favor the former for multiple reasons. In any case, this is where the discussion needs to go. If those who favor a nuclear fission induced destruction scenario are correct, there are literally tens of thousands of people who are at risk for developing lethal cancers and other significant disabilities. It is vital that they be apprised of the risks that they face. Further discussion of thermite/nanothermite is unlikely to result in that end.

 

[T Mark Hightower]

Today I was on Jim Fetzer's show, The Real Deal.  I presented my work which also included calculations for quantities of conventional high explosives that would have been needed to do the job.  I clearly state the assumptions made for the calculations.  I believe that Jim told me the show may not be archived until about next Monday at http://radiofetzer.blogspot.com/

I had a Power Point presentation for the show, which I have uploaded below.  During the show I verbally refuted all 10 citations in Kevin Ryan's article "The explosive nature of nanothermite," which he had posted on 911blogger on June 20, the day The Nanothermite Challenge ended with no entries.

http://911blogger.com/news/2011-06-20/explosive-nature-nanothermite

All of my files are available on my scribd web page http://www.scribd.com/tmhightower

[Dr. J. P. Hubert]

Great Mark. I reviewed your power point presentation and found it very interesting.  I can't wait to listen to your interview with Dr. Fetzer. 

 

If I understand you correctly, you estimate that roughly 840,000 pounds of RDX would have been required to destroy one Twin Tower without reducing all of the concrete to dust. You are saying if I understand it correctly, that much more than that would have been required to turn all of the concrete to dust if it is possible at all with conventional explosives since your calculations did not assume the concrete was pulverized into dust powder. Do I have that correct?

 

Are you saying that the observed explosive energy release up and out away from each Tower could have been caused by that amount of RDX or would it have required more since in a normal controlled (implosion type) demolition, this hurling of material up and out does not occur?  I find it hard to believe that 850,000 pounds of RDX could have caused such explosive energy.

 

As I understand your material, you believe that even a high explosive type nanothermite in the 850 m/s range could not have accomplished the observed destruction even if the larger amount of nanothermite (assuming an R.E. of 2.7 yields over 2, 295,000 pounds of nanothermite per Tower) was utilized.

 

I think you have provided strong evidence that nanothermite was to a high degree of probability not involved a conclusion which agrees with the problems related to the chain of custody issues vis a vis the dust sample collection utilized in the Harrit et. al study.

 

Thank you for your excellent work.

[T Mark Hightower]

You are understanding my presentation correctly.  I have not yet found a way to estimate how much RDX would be needed to turn all the concrete to dust.  I suspect that it would be a very large amount.

 

The calculation where I assumed a relative effectiveness factor of 0.6 for the 895 m/s nanothermite in order to determine that it would take 2.7 times as much nanothermite than RDX, was very much a hypothetical exercise.  It's like we know, that based on the low detonation velocity of 895 m/s for the nanothermite, that no amount of it would be able to cut the steel by means of shock wave effects (or any other effects), but let's pretend that it could do it, and assume a RE factor of 0.6 (very generous value) and then calculate how much it would take, just for the sake of illustration.

 

By the way, a very interesting thing came up during the interview.  I was commenting upon one of the references that Kevin Ryan cited, an article in Technology Review published by MIT of January 21, 2005, entitled "Military Reloads with Nanotech."

http://www.technologyreview.com/computing/14105/page1/

I noted that the article also referred to the application of nanotechnology to mini-nukes.  I will paste below the paragraphs from the end of the article that refer to this.

 

Nanotechnology "could completely change the face of weaponry," according to Andy Oppenheimer, a weapons expert with analyst firm and publisher Jane's Information Group. Oppenheimer says nations including the United States, Germany, and Russia are developing "mini-nuke" devices that use nanotechnology to create much smaller nuclear detonators.

Oppenheimer says the devices could fit inside a briefcase and would be powerful enough to destroy a building. Although the devices require nuclear materials, because of their small size "they blur the line with conventional weapons," Oppenheimer says.

The mini-nuke weapons are still in the research phase and may be surreptitiously funded since any form of nuclear proliferation is "politically contentious" because of the possibility that they could fall into the hands of terrorists, Oppenheimer says.

The creation of much smaller nuclear bombs adds new challenges to the effort to limit weapons of mass destruction, according to Oppenheimer.

"(The bombs) could blow open everything that is in place for arms control," Oppenheimer says. "Everything gets more dangerous."

[jane doe]

I have posted this video of the sphere hitting the tower on David Icke forum. Although you can see the sphere on the original video that I have, in the transfer to youtube the video went down a generation, you can't see it in the video. I took the video apart frame by frame, enlarged 5 frames and circled the sphere. David Icke thread post is here:

 

http://forum.davidicke.com/showpost.php?p=1060161270&postcount=672

 

Thread: http://forum.davidicke.com/showthread.php?t=133535&page=68

The WTC was hollow, gutted before 9/11: no debris

[jane doe]

NYC has 176 zip codes.

There are 41 zip codes in Manhattan, 37 in Brooklyn, 61 in Queens, 25 in the Bronx, and 12 on Staten Island, for a total of 176 zip codes in New York City. One building in NYC has its own zip code : the Federal Reserve Bank, 33 Liberty Street, 10045. The World Trade Center had its own, as well, which is now inactive but reserved : 10048.

There are 8,210,000 people in NYC, There are over 19.3 million residents living in the entire state of New York. NY is the most densely populated city in the United States. It is also the number 1 market in the U.S.

 

World Trade Center Stats
200,000 tons of steel 425,000 cubic yards of concrete 43,600 windows 12,000 miles of electric cables Had its own zip code, 10048

You have noted 12,000 miles of electric cables, but there were no cables, office furniture, toilets, computers, copy machines in the less than 3 stories of debris on 911. WHY? BECAUSE the WTC TOWERS were GUTTED and prepped for demolition on 911.

[Jeannon Kralj]

"

You have noted 12,000 miles of electric cables, but there were no cables, office furniture, toilets, computers, copy machines in the less than 3 stories of debris on 911. WHY? BECAUSE the WTC TOWERS were GUTTED and prepped for demolition on 911."

I've narrowed it down to...

Argumentum ad ignorantiam

 

Cum hoc ergo propter hoc

 

Dicto simpliciter

 

Non Sequitur

 

Petitio principia

 

[jane doe]

Same people with the same tired non-arguments. Excuse me, the towers were gutted, prepped for demolition on 911 01. It was a plan by Strategic Communication Laboratories, London. Op Northwoods/Mongoose nixed by Kennedy for Cuba, recycled to use television instead of radio.

 

Remember Orson Welles, War of the World? No. Theatre Arts 101 would have been a beneficial class for you. The rest of us took it for fun and a mick grade. It seems there are actually people like you two, who have heard of Welles PUNK of the WORLD. If Welles were mean and a lucifierian as the U.S. ,govt is, he could have overtaken the world with his production. Instead, he admitted it was a PUNK.

 

As for Bush Cheney et al. The STOLE money from the American people and the WORLD for their own aggrandizement: Death Hoax Fraud-$6 billion,, Real Estate Fraud-$7.2 billion, stock market manipulation and insider trading on American & United Put Options $2 billion worldwide, if not more, art market insurance fraud-$100 million. The insured artwork was removed from the towers before 911 & claimed as being lost, $100 million.

 

My point of posting zip codes in NYC is that there are 176 zip codes in NYC. WTC was just one. Federal Reserve has its own zip code. Your arguments are weak and senseless. You are the only 2 people who post on this thread. I am done with this forum. Why would anyone want to pay to join a forum where the same people post all the time. I like Jim Fetzer, but to be honest, this forum is worthless. GOODbye, paid posting punks.