9/11 Scholars Forum

Exposing Falsehoods and Revealing Truths

Ken Bell: Some of the implications of "There were no commercial planes on 9/11"

Date: Wed, 07 Oct 2009 11:41:55 -0400 [10:41:55 AM CDT]
From: "Ken Bell"
To: "Michael Morrissey" , "John Lear"
Cc: [Show addresses - 23 recipients]
Subject: Re: Sabotage of 9/11--John Lear's Affidavit about the Non-Occurrence of Twin Tower hits

What does no commercial planes on 9-11 really mean? What are the implications? And would it explain the violent reaction to never investigate or talk about it from so many? Here are just a few samples of what no commercial planes on 9-11 means:

· It would mean Larry Silverstein committed the largest insurance fraud in world history
· It would mean Bush lied about watching the first plane go into WTC 1
· It would mean hundreds of staged “terrorist drill participants” on the morning of 911 also lied. They were involved with a program called Tripod II in NYC on the very morning of 911.
· It would mean the “news” media and the hundreds of witnesses that were directly connected to the media companies themselves all lied about what they saw.
· It would mean that Rupert Murdoch and his video feed to the world on every channel was a staged, conspired, and complicit lie to kill 1000’s of people
· It would call into question all leading media personnel who have refused to even allow ANY discussion of this topic such as Amy Goodman of NPR, Bill Maher, Arianna Huffington, Noam Chomsky, Tom Hartman…..add more of your own names. These people covered it up and allowed no dissention or discussion. They must be considered perpetrators.
· It would mean the Bush hand selected committee of 911 Commission is and would have been a complete farce (many already know this just based on results)
· It would expose the “remote controlled plane theory” as a rabbit hole. What this theory does is even if you are unsure that remotes may have been used…you are forced into accepting that there are planes to control in the first place.
· THERE WERE NO HIGHJACKERS. That means everyone in government, law enforcement, military, FBI, CIA, White House, media ALL lied and conspired to pass blame to people who never existed. This explains why 8 of the 19 are still alive and why none of them were on any passenger list or have ever been identified with DNA
· It would mean workers in Shanksville, at ground zero, and the Pentagon all planted evidence at a crime scene (Laura Bush “hired” the person that found the Bible on top of the Shanksville site to become her “personal driver” immediately after 9-11?!! That was weird?!!!!)
· ALL of the “amateur footage” that was taken on the morning of 911 was doctored and fraudulent. The people that have reported and given as evidence their false video must be prosecuted. ALL of the amateur video was turned into authorities days after 911 giving plenty of time for the forgeries (some not very good and horribly inconsistent with each other)
· It means that millions of civilians and untold thousands of soldiers have been killed and slaughtered based on a known and conspired crime. War on Terror was a lie. ALL of it.
· Just the mere mention that there were no planes on 911 will have you banned from “truth groups” and deleted from even the most liberal of website forums. There are Trillions of dollars at stake should the public realize that no commercial planes crashed on 911.
· ALL the witnesses from USA Today at the Pentagon lied about the planes. They must be tried for treason.
· If this was a “New Pearl Harbor” we must go back and review everything regarding the fact that Pearl Harbor itself was a staged and conspired and fraudulent event. Is there any evidence to support the government claims of Pearl Harbor? Any Japanese planes shot down? Any testing of the ships for man-made explosives allowed?
· It also forces you to go back and see if this was planned since Bush took office and also the evidence that Bush fixed the elections in 2000 and 2004 to bring about this crime. His Presidency in the future could easily become “null and void”. His could be the first Presidency that the US could say never really happened because of all the known lies, cheating, fraud, conspiracy, crimes, and election rigging.
· “Authorities” and criminals within government have always said there was NO controlled demolition because it was the “planes” that brought the towers down. No planes means that of course the WTC’s 1, 2, and 7 were brought down with controlled demolitions and it implicates dozens of government agencies like NIST, FEMA, FAA that all lied about the results, tests, and testimonies.
· No planes also forces you to look VERY CLOSELY at the passenger lists of the 4 planes reported missing on 911. Did any of them have close ties to banking, military, law or law enforcement, media, government, or insurance…….basically the groups that profited the most from 911? (95% of all the passengers on all 4 planes have direct ties to these groups of perpetrators! Look for yourself)

That was just ONE dozen examples. Right now I have over 42,000 of these and add at least a dozen a day. It never ends. Finding holes in the lies is easy….because there were no commercial planes on 9-11.

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Morrissey
To: John Lear
Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 2:49 AM
Subject: Re: Sabotage of 9/11--John Lear's Affidavit about the Non-Occurrence of Twin Tower hits

What John says, combined with Ken's statement:

Just one problem with the debris of 9-11...not one single piece has ever been verified. Not one. The world was shown pieces.....then never allowed to see or verify them ever again?!!!

is what we need to throw at P4T, Frank Legge, and Jim Hoffman. Is this the first time in history that there has even been any doubt about whether or not a plane crashed (and on 9/11 4 times!)? I mean on land, not in the Bermuda Triangle. Even crashes at sea leave verifiable debris, don't they? This would be an important and impressive statement to make, but I am not going to make it just on Ken's say-so.

I assume the govt says the debris and bodies have been identified, and not allow anyone else to verify any of it. How often has that happened in history?

I don't know where to begin to research these questions. I wish I could ask my late uncle, who worked for the FAA (and thought the CFR was the source of all evil). Any ideas?

John, do you have any connections with FAA people or suchlike who could answer questions like this from a "historical" point of view, i.e., without having to stick their neck out regarding 9/11?

Haven't heard from Morgan Reynolds in a while. How are you doing, Morgan?

On 07.10.2009, at 05:21, John Lear wrote:

First of all who where the passengers that Flight 93 dropped off at Cleveland and were herded
into the NASA hangar?

Now, if you are going to say that the UAL 93 got mixed with the Delta flight then who were the passengers
from Delta that got herded into the NASA hangar?

As I have mentioned before the Boeing 757 has (according to Boeing) 1.5 million parts that are stamped and coded

by either Boeing or an authorized PMA (parts manufacturer authority). And about 60 miles of wire which is stamped and coded ever 12 inches.

So lets figure out how many state and federal officials we would need to pick everything up and hide it. I have never seen or read a legitimate heard a coroners report except Millers and his can’t be correct because he said he saw no bodies or blood. So somebody had to see bodies and blood if a Boeing 757 got shot down .

So lets say we could round up 200 state and federal officials, swear them to secrecy and start picking up pieces. There were 2 engines each weighing about 3 tons each. So after they cooled down we are going to need about, assuming each guy can lift 100 pounds, 60 guys per engine. So thats 120 guys for both engines. And then we were going to have to load it onto a truck to take to Mt. Weather. Then we will need 2 guys, one to bag the body and one to carry the seat for the 40 passengers and crews so that’s another 80 State and Federal officials.

Now there are lot more deaths than there were seats occupied so we subtract the 40 total from 182 average seating and thats another 142 seats have to be carried away. Another 142 State and Federal officials.

Now, although the wings may have been demolished they still weigh the same. Matter does not disintegrate in a crash. So the wing span for Boeing 757 is 124 ft. 10 inches and lets say, for example, it broke into 4 equal pieces. I would estimate that each piece of wing averages out to about 20,000 pounds. Just a guess. So if we can get each guy to lift up 100 pounds we will need 800 State and Federal officials to lift up the wings and load them on the semi trucks.

It highly doubtful that we are going to find any gigantic cranes in Shanksville to help lift this stuff up onto the semis. So now we are going to have to lift the aft fuselage which will probably be disconnected from the tail and all scrunched up. The aft fuselage is the heaviest part of the fuselage because it has to have the strength to keep from breaking in half at high airspeeds when the tail is pushing down to counteract the forward fuselage pushing up due to the center of lift moving aft on the wing as the speed increases.

So lets figure 30,000 pounds of scrunched up aluminum and at hundred pounds per man that’s 300 men which will put us at 1,762 Local and State officials and we haven’t started on the tail yet. Also the landing gear bogeys are pretty heavy, so now were getting up to about 2000 State and Federal officials just to get the stuff loaded and tied down not mention all of the security clearances that are going to have to be filled out plus getting semi truck drivers and credit cards for gas and wide load permits and stuff like that. The mind boggles.

Then we are going to have to rake and secure the area and declare it an area of National Security so that those EPA boys don’t come sniffing around with their soil sample kits of the Jet A fuel. And somebody will have to account for all of the jet fuel soaked up in the soil.

This is just a ball park summary of how we are going to have to clean up an airplane that was shot down and hide it underground at Mt. Weather.

And it really going to be a problem keeping it a secret because so many people are involved.


From: Rolf Lindgren [mailto:rolfusaugustusadolphus@yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 2:29 PM
To: Bruce Rideout; Big Guy; Ken Bell; David Hawkins; jfetzer@d.umn.edu; avalonbeef@msn.com

Subject: Re: Sabotage of 9/11--John Lear's Affidavit about the Non-Occurrence of Twin Tower hits

FL93 was shot down at 9:58, high in the air. The "crash site" was faked. In reality the debris was scattered all over the place, several square miles, in remote areas. State and federal officails quickly picked up as much of it as they could, before the public saw it.

Interesting, the governor of Pennsylvania was Tom Ridge, who later became head of homeland security.

All the phone calls on FL93 end at 9:58, except the calls by Todd Beamer and Jeremy Glick. These calls were not made from FL93.

Maybe John Lear can tell us how long it takes a plane high in the air, at 30,000 to 40,000 feet, to hit the ground?

Views: 287


You need to be a member of 9/11 Scholars Forum to add comments!

Join 9/11 Scholars Forum

Comment by Thoth II on October 21, 2009 at 8:15pm

I wonder if this ever happened in the history of air crashes, ever? I doubt it. This is strong indication that those planes hit nothing that day. Put that together with the fake videos purporting a plane to hit south tower, and the case against planes is probably getting settled down now. (I have no idea what did happen to those flights, maybe they never took off, or if some of them did, terrible things happened to the passengers, and it had nothing to do with crashing).
Comment by James H. Fetzer on October 21, 2009 at 12:35pm
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:42:39 -0400 [10:42:39 AM CDT]
From: "Ken Bell"
To: "Bruce Rideout" , "Jack & Sue White" , "Alex LLoyd"
Cc: [Show addresses - 25 recipients]
Subject: Re: Proof of Video Fakery

Please remove me from this thread!!!!!!!

Blast expert Allyn E. Kilsheimer was the first structural engineer to arrive at the Pentagon after the crash and helped coordinate the emergency response. “It was absolutely a plane, and I’ll tell you why,” says Kilsheimer, CEO of KCE Structural Engineers PC, Washington, D.C. “I saw the marks of the plane wing on the face of the building. I picked up parts of the plane with the airline markings on them. I held in my hand the tail section of the plane, and I found the black box.” Kilsheimer’s eyewitness account is backed up by photos of plane wreckage inside and outside the building. Kilsheimer adds: “I held parts of uniforms from crew members in my hands, including body parts. Okay?”

Q: ““It was absolutely a plane, and I’ll tell you why,” says Kilsheimer

R: Why would anyone on the planet have to “tell you why” there was absolutely a plane??!!!! Because there is not nor has there ever been ANY verifiable wreckage from ANY of the 4 planes from 9-11…let alone Pentagon. Why “TELL” someone and just let them go over to any of the MILLIONS of pieces which can instantly verify a particular plane and allow ANYONE to verify the debris???!!! Because there were no commercial plane crashes on 9-11.

Q: ““I saw the marks of the plane wing on the face of the building.”

R: That’s in direct contradiction to the USA Today “witnesses” who said the wings never impacted and simply “folded back” into the plane. According to their witnessing…that’s why no wings were ever found. Though according to Mr. Kilsheimer they made a mark and left NO wings?!! (A FIRST in aviation history!!! NO WING has ever been recovered from ANY of the 4 planes from ANY of the 4 locations on 9-11. A first in aviation history and it happened 4 times on 9-11?!!!)

Q: “I picked up parts of the plane with the airline markings on them.”

R: That’s a felony. He is a reported “blast expert” not aviation crime scene investigator?!!!! He has just admitted to tampering, moving, and destroying evidence at the largest mass murder in US history?!!!!! It may have markings….though markings have never in aviation history verified a single plane. Only the serial numbers can verify the plane. LOW A BEHOLD….NONE of the supposed pieces and “parts with markings” have ANY serial numbers.?!!! Another first in aviation history and it happened 4 times on 9-11.

Q: “I held in my hand the tail section of the plane”

R: Unsure what to say? NO Tail section has ever been found in any way from any of the 4 planes from any of the 4 locations on 9-11. How is he able to hold the 44ft tailsection of a 767 in his hands?!!!!!

Q: “and I found the black box”

R: That’s great. NONE of the black boxes, NONE of the voice data recorders, and NONE of the flight data recorders had SERIAL NUMBERS!!! NONE OF THEM! It is irrelevant what you found with regards to any black boxes on 911…..NONE OF THEM HAD SERIAL NUMBERS?!!!!! That means these important parts are completely worthless and could never be used in a court of law. ps….its also the first time in aviation history in which ALL 3 boxes and recorders had no serial numbers…and it happened FOUR TIMES in one day on 9-11. Another first in aviation history.

Q: “Kilsheimer’s eyewitness account is backed up by photos of plane wreckage inside and outside the building.”

R: Again…that all sounds great….its just that….NOT ONE SINGLE PIECE OF DEBRIS FROM ANY OF THE 4 PLANES FROM ANY OF THE 4 LOCATIONS ON 9-11 HAS EVER BEEN TESTED, INPSECTED, ANALYZED, OR VERIFIED IN ANY WAY BY ANYONE AS HAVING COME FROM ANY OF THE SUPPOSED PLANES OF 9-11. Not one single piece. Why? Because there were no commercial plane crashes on 9-11. It was a lie to invade and maintain a never ending war while borrowing trillions for the ability to kill millions forever.

Q: “Kilsheimer adds: “I held parts of uniforms from crew members in my hands, including body parts. Okay?””

R: Interesting statement. The “okay” at the end should pretty much tell you that not even he believes it. Though something else is much more disturbing with that sentence: “I held parts of the uniforms….” Notice how he says the uniforms as if somehow there were absolutely no bodies attached?! He then mentions “parts” as if those were somehow not attached to the “uniforms”?!!! How does a “blast expert” know the difference between military uniforms at the Pentagon and uniforms of flight crews?!!

If it was a crime scene as labeled by the FBI within seconds of the explosions, what is a blast expert from an engineering company doing on the scene!?!?!??!?!?! Labeling it a crime scene is what “legally” kept out the NTSB from going to any of the crash sites from 911. Keep in mind the NTSB only works from verifiable plane parts which is why they were allowed nowhere near any of the sites on 9-11.

There were no commercial plane crashes on 9-11.

Ps….Kilsheimer has received $21,962,301 in DOD spending since 9/11!!!!!

KCE is on the list below. This list of perpetrators of 9-11 does not even include any “media” :

ACE Bermuda Insurance

AMEC Construction

AIG Insurance

Air Traffic Control System Command Center in Washington

Alexandria VA Fire & Rescue

Allianz Global Risks

American Airlines

American Concrete Institute

American Institute of Steel Construction

American Red Cross

Applied Biosystems Inc.

Applied Research Associates

Arlington County Emergency Medical Services

Arlington County Fire Department

Arlington County Sheriff's Department

Arlington VA Police Department

Armed Forces Institute of Pathology

Armed Forces Institute of Technology Federal Advisory Committee


Atlantic Heydt Inc.


Berlin Fire Department

Big Apple Wrecking

Blanford & Co.

Bode Technology Group

Bovis Inc.

Building and Construction Trades Council

Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms

C-130H crew in D.C. & Shanksville

Cal Berkeley Engineering Dept.

California Incident Management Team

Carter Burgess Engineering

Celera Genomics

Centers for Disease Control

Central City Fire Department

Central Intelligence Agency

Cleveland Airport control tower

Columbia University Department of Civil Engineering and Engineering Mechanics

Congressional Joint Intelligence Committee

Consolidated Edison Company

Construction Technologies Laboratory

Controlled Demolitions Inc.

Council on Tall Buildings and Urban Habitat

Counterterrorism and Security Group

CTL Engineering

D.H. Griffin Wrecking Co. Inc.

DeSimone Consulting Engineers

Dewhurst MacFarlane &Partners

DiSalvo Ericson Engineering

District of Columbia Fire & Rescue

DOD Honor Guard, Pentagon

D'Onofrio Construction

E-4B National Airborne Operations Center crews

Edwards and Kelcey Engineering

Engineering Systems, Inc.

Environmental protection Agency

Exponent Failure Analysis Associates

EYP Mission CriticalFacilities

Fairfax County Fire & Rescue

Falcon 20 crew in PA

Family members who received calls from victims on the planes

FBI Evidence Recovery Teams

Federal Aviation Administration

Federal Bureau of Investigation

Federal Emergency Management Agency

Federal Insurance Co.

FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams: Arizona Task Force 1, California Task Force 1, California Task Force 3, California Task Force 7, Colorado Task Force 1, Fairfax Task Force 1, Florida Task Force 1, Florida Task Force 2, Maryland Task Force 1, Massachusetts Task Force 1, Metro Dade/Miami, Nebraska Task Force 1, New Mexico Task Force 1, New York Task Force 1, Pennsylvania Task Force 1, Tennessee Task Force 1, Texas Task Force 1, Utah Task Force 1, Virginia Task Force 1, Virginia Task Force 2, Washington Task Force 1

FEMA Disaster Field Office

FEMA Emergency Response Team

FEMA Urban Search and Rescue Incident Support Team-Advanced 3

Fire Department of New York

Fort Myer Fire Department

French Urban Search & Rescue Task Force

Friedens Volunteer Fire Department

Gateway Demolition

Gene Code Forensics

Georgia Tech Engineering Dept.

Gilsanz Murray Steficek LLP

GMAC Financing

Goldstein Associates Consulting Engineers

Guy Nordenson Associates

HAKS Engineers

Hampton-Clarke Inc.

HHS National Medical Response Team

HLW International Engineering

Hooversville Rescue Squad.

Hooversville Volunteer Fire Department

Hoy Structural Services

Hughes Associates, Inc

Hugo Neu Schnitzer East

hundreds of ironworkers, some of whom built the WTC

Hundreds of New York City Police Department Detectives

Industrial Risk Insurers

Institute for Civil Infrastructure Systems

International Association of Fire Chiefs

International Union of Operating Engineers Locals 14 & 15

J.R. Harris & Company

Karl Koch Steel Consulting Inc.

KCE Structural Engineers

Koch Skanska

Koutsoubis, Alonso Associates

Laboratory Corp. of America

Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory

Leslie E. Robertson Associates

LIRo Engineering

Listie Volunteer Fire Company

Lockwood Consulting

M.G. McLaren Engineering

Masonry Society

Mazzocchi Wrecking Inc.

Metal Management Northeast

Metropolitan Airport Authority Fire Unit

Miami-Dade Urban Search & Rescue

Military District of Washington Search & Rescue Team

Montgomery County Fire & Rescue

Mueser Rutledge Consulting Engineers

Murray Engineering

Myriad Genetic Laboratories Inc.

National Center for Biotechnology Informatics

National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States

National Council of Structural Engineers Associations

National Disaster Medical System

National Emergency Numbering Association

National Fire Protection Association

National Guard in D.C., New York, and Pennsylvania

National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST)

National Institutes of Health Human Genome Research Institute

National Law Enforcement and Security Institute

National Military Command Center

National Reconnaissance Office

National Response Center

National Science Foundation Division of Civil and Mechanical Systems

National Security Agency

National Transportation Safety Board

National Wrecking

Natural Hazards Research and Applications Information Center

New Jersey State Police

New York City Department of Buildings WTC Task Force

New York City Department of Design and Construction

New York City Department of Environmental Protection

New York City Office of Emergency Management

New York City Office of the Chief Medical Examiner

New York City Police Department Aviation Unit

New York City Police Department Emergency Services Unit

New York Daily News

New York Flight Control Center

New York Newsday

New York Port Authority Construction Board

New York Port Authority Police

New York State Emergency Management Office

New York State Police Forensic Services

New York Times

North American Aerospace Defense Command

Northeast Air Defense Sector Commanders and crew

Numerous bomb-sniffing dogs

Numerous Forensic Anthropologists

Numerous Forensic Dentists

Numerous Forensic Pathologists

Numerous Forensic Radiologists


Occupational Safety and Health Administration

Office of Emergency Preparedness

Office of Strategic Services

Orchid Cellmark

Parsons Brinckerhoff Engineering

Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection

Pennsylvania Department of Health and Human Services

Pennsylvania Region 13 Metropolitan Medical Response Group

Pennsylvania State Funeral Directors Association

Pennsylvania State Police

Pentagon Defense Protective Service

Pentagon Helicopter Crash Response Team

Pentagon Medical Staff

Pentagon Renovation Team

Phillips & Jordan, Inc.

Port of New York and New Jersey Authority

Pro-Safety Services


Public Entity Risk Institute

Purdue University Engineering Dept.

Robert Silman Associates Structural Engineers

Rolf Jensen & Associates, Inc

Rosenwasser/Grossman Consulting Engineers

Royal SunAlliance/Royal Indemnity

SACE Prime Power Assessment Teams

SACE Structural Safety Engineers and Debris Planning and Response Teams

Salvation Army Disaster Services

several EPA Hazmat Teams

several FBI Hazmat Teams

several Federal Disaster Medical Assistance Teams

several Federal Disaster Mortuary (DMORT) Teams

Severud Associates Consulting Engineers

Shanksville Volunteer Fire Company

Silverstein Properties

Simpson Gumpertz & Heger Engineers

Skidmore, Owings & Merrill LLP

Skilling Ward Magnusson Barkshire

Society of Fire Protection Engineers

Somerset Ambulance Association

Somerset County Coroner's Office

Somerset County Emergency Management Agency

Somerset Volunteer Fire Department

St. Paul/Travelers Insurance

State of Pennsylvania Emergency Management Agency

Stoystown Volunteer Fire Company

Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE)

Structural Engineers Association of New York

Superstructures Engineering

Swiss Re America Insurance

Telephone operators who took calls from passengers in the hijacked planes

Teng & Associates

Thornton-Tomasetti Group, Inc.

TIG Insurance

Tokio Marine & Fire

Transportation Safety Administration

Tully Construction

Twin City Fire Insurance

Tylk Gustafson Reckers Wilson Andrews Engineering

U.S. Army Corps of Engineers

Underwriters Laboratories

Union Wrecking

United Airlines

United States Air National Guard

United States Fire Administration

United States Secret Service

United Steelworkers of America

University of Sheffield Fire Engineering Research

US Army Reserves of Virginia Beach Fairfax County and Montgomery County

US Army’s Communications-Electronics Command

US Department of Defense

US Department of Justice

US Department of State

Virginia Beach Fire Department

Virginia Department of Emergency Management

Virginia State Police

Vollmer Associates Engineers

Washington Post

Weeks Marine

Weidlinger Associates

Weiskopf & Pickworth Engineering

Westmoreland County Emergency Management Agency

Whitney Contracting

Willis Group Holdings

WJE Structural Engineers

Worcester Polytechnic Institute

World Trade Center security staff

XL Insurance

Yonkers Contracting

York International

Zurich Financial

Zurich Re Risk Engineering

© 2021   Created by James H. Fetzer.   Powered by

Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service